Regulations/health&safety - 10 things I'm wondering about.

[Hostel Witness]

See this place is great because I can get ideas from people on things I've never thought about. One thing I was wondering is what's the story with rules, regulations, health and safety and insurance. What do I need to consider.
Now obviously it would depend on where I want to do it, but surely there are some universal considerations no matter where I decide to set up shop

1. Fire - I'm guess this would be the most important, fire alarms, fire escapes, fire extinguisers - would I have to have fire drills regularly? Did I miss anything?

2. smoke detectors in the rooms. I guess this is a good way to detect if anyone's smoking in bed, which could possibly send the place up like the towering inferno. So I'd imagine having lots of smoke detectors in the rooms.
Which brings me onto...

3. Smoking - here in Ireland we were the first to enact the smoking ban. Wasn't happy @ the time, but I've since cast my beloved Marlboros aside and can now climb stairs without wheezing. I do think a choice should be offered and though I'm off them, I still see myself as something of a champion of smoker rights (an oppressed minority if ever there was one) but, like I said above, I ain't too big on the idea of people smoking inside the building, especially in the beds, so I might just insist on a no-smoking hostel, despite myself.

4. Course it's not just cigarettes is it? So if you smell some, like someone in a room or whatever, how would you all deal with it? Y'know, I like a bitta ganja from time to time but I don't want nobody partaking on my premisis. Last thing I want is to open up in some foreign country and have the local narc-gestapo tearing my place apart.

5. Insurance - what sort of insurance would you use? I'd imagine you would need special insurance if offering accomodation, not to mention to protect your own property - the building, its fittings, etc - as well as the property of others - i.e. their bags or any valuables they entrust to your safe. Any comments/reccomendations on that?

6. Actual rules - I'd be interested to see what people have down under their rules section/regulations section. I was thinking having them sign the rules as part of their check-in process. Feel free to paste/post/attach any rules in here.

7. Hygiene - same deal, what should I be considering hygiene wise? Do you all have shared bathrooms/showers or how do you do it?

8. I sorta asked about security already. I was thinking lots of CCTV plus an alarm system and a decent safe for valuables. Any other suggestions?

9. Would there be any planning issues - do you think - with opening such a place? I've a strange feeling that I coudl set up shop somewhere only to have some little bald man in a grey suit telling me I can't open because of some zoning BS or whatever. I also imagine it would be quite possible that people might object to such an establishment also.

10. Any other regulations or aspects I should be thinking about?

[Hostels]

I think it's a good idea not to allow smoking indoors in hostels. Travellers with bronchitis or asthma might have problems if they have to spend any time in smoky rooms.

I've been to some hostels where there were no rules ("no rules" was the official policy). I think that only works in smaller, laid-back places. In the city hostels I've worked at there were lists of rules that people had to sign for at check-in. I'll see if I can find a list.

I worked in one hostel that had group bathrooms (one bathroom per floor) and there were always bad reviews about it. It might not have been so bad if the hostel would have kept them cleaner. Group bathrooms are not necessarily bad, but I think they have to be kept spotless to avoid complaints.

A good example of group bathrooms that were designed well are at Youth Hostel Plakias in Crete that I mentioned before. When you walk in there you know it's probably going to be clean, have toilet seats, and have toilet paper. It looks like it was designed to be easy to keep clean from the beginning.

For security I would offer lockers in every room ("bring your own lock"). Big enough for a laptop and camera. Many people (myself included) don't like leaving electronics at the front desk. I know a couple of hostels where the biggest theft risks were from the employees. I've even seen a situation where a housekeeper (transient) would steal from guests but still not get fired because there were not enough people to staff the hostel.

I still don't leave any valuables at front desks because of those experiences. I think it's more of a problem at big city hostels with high employee turnover... and in the case of that hostel, just bad management. I really like having sturdy lockers in the room that allow me to attach my own lock.

[Hostel Witness]

Erm, I'm *from* Ireland but I've no notion of starting one here.
(the whole point of me registering here was to find out about setting a place up someplace warm and where the running costs would be less crippling.)

Tourism is on the sliding slope here anyway. Now that most people have realised that we're among the most expensive countries in Europe and that our level of service isn't always the best. [/understatement]

Concurrently, the running costs of such an establishment - particularly in a large city [where there's bound to be competition] - are enormous, just to buy/rent/lease the property the costs are waaaaay to high, not to mention utilities, rates, insurance all all those other ways they've devised to screw you. Ireland is ridiculously expensive anyway, which is why I want to buy someplace foreign. Why should I drop a few hundred thou for a drizzly little bungalow in smucksville when I can set up an entire business in paradise!

I'd caution anyone who wants to invest in such a venture in Ireland to think twice. There was a time when tourism was one of our main industries. (actually one could say it was one of our only industries) Back then tourists, particularly Americans, would come in their droves. It was interesting, it was quaint and best of all it was cheap so the terrible weather and third world services weren't so much of an issue. But then, as our economy got better, we got greedier [another *massive* understatement], we kept the same 3rd world service, we still have the same horrendous climate - but now we want to charge you extortionate amounts of money for the priviledge. Our traditional tourist base - the US - who had once been a loud roar along the hills of Killarney, have dwindled away to a mere whisper, helped in no small part by a feeble dollar. American tourists of my youth were flamboyant big spenders, driving around in rented Benzes, reknowned for such crazy stunts as buying a round for the house and leaving gargantuan tips. Nowdays they're penny-pinchers who travel around in buses and instead of buying rounds for the house they ask for glasses of tap water. (seriously!)
As for European tourists, they're the same. Germans used to be another huge demographic here but they're just not coming back anymore, likewise the Dutch and French. Ireland used to be the place for young Britons to come over for weekend breaks and get loaded, but it's a sad day when the cost of a round of drinks is more than a plane ticket. The opening up of Eastern Europe has also dealt a major blow to our tourist industry; cheaper, better weather, better service.

I know the touirst industry well, I've been working in a related industry and my partner has been involved with the tourist industry here for almost five years. I'm in a tourist area myself and it's become a ghost town. I also know a lot of people who run B&Bs and other tourist-related industries, they're not getting the numbers. All the "holiday homes" that were built out here are either derilict or rented out to locals - and yet they keep building the bloody things - go fig! See that's the thing with Ireland - we keep building and building and building and building - the great Babylonian tower that is the Irish Economy, and nobody wants to admit what we all know to be true. You can't keep building forever, sometime, maybe tomorrow, maybe in five years, it's all going to come collapsing down on top of us.

At any rate, if there's anyone out there reading this who has their heart set on setting up a hostel in Ireland I would suggest someplace along the coast, the Ring of Kerry, West Clare - such as Doolin - or Galway, the Arann Islands, Achill Island in Mayo or Donegal - but you'll have competition to be sure, to be sure. Coastal Ireland is popular for all sorts of tourists, from the big tourbus people, to surfers. Get a lot of Aussie surfers around the cost of Clare actually. [always amused me that your average Aussie wouldn't swim @ home until mid summer (november), yet will gladly plunge into the icy depths of the Atlantic during mid-winter (also november)]

A much safer bet would be concentrating not on tourists, but on migrant workers from Poland, Latvia, Lithuania or Brazil, by offering cheap lodgings for them.

Wow, way to completely veer from one topic to another there huh?

[Rick O'Shae]

Erm, I'm *from* Ireland but I've no notion of starting one here.
(the whole point of me registering here was to find out about setting a place up someplace warm and where the running costs would be less crippling.)

Tourism is on the sliding slope here anyway. Now that most people have realised that we're among the most expensive countries in Europe and that our level of service isn't always the best. [/understatement]

Concurrently, the running costs of such an establishment - particularly in a large city [where there's bound to be competition] - are enormous, just to buy/rent/lease the property the costs are waaaaay to high, not to mention utilities, rates, insurance all all those other ways they've devised to screw you. Ireland is ridiculously expensive anyway, which is why I want to buy someplace foreign. Why should I drop a few hundred thou for a drizzly little bungalow in smucksville when I can set up an entire business in paradise!

I'd caution anyone who wants to invest in such a venture in Ireland to think twice. There was a time when tourism was one of our main industries. (actually one could say it was one of our only industries) Back then tourists, particularly Americans, would come in their droves. It was interesting, it was quaint and best of all it was cheap so the terrible weather and third world services weren't so much of an issue. But then, as our economy got better, we got greedier [another *massive* understatement], we kept the same 3rd world service, we still have the same horrendous climate - but now we want to charge you extortionate amounts of money for the priviledge. Our traditional tourist base - the US - who had once been a loud roar along the hills of Killarney, have dwindled away to a mere whisper, helped in no small part by a feeble dollar. American tourists of my youth were flamboyant big spenders, driving around in rented Benzes, reknowned for such crazy stunts as buying a round for the house and leaving gargantuan tips. Nowdays they're penny-pinchers who travel around in buses and instead of buying rounds for the house they ask for glasses of tap water. (seriously!)
As for European tourists, they're the same. Germans used to be another huge demographic here but they're just not coming back anymore, likewise the Dutch and French. Ireland used to be the place for young Britons to come over for weekend breaks and get loaded, but it's a sad day when the cost of a round of drinks is more than a plane ticket. The opening up of Eastern Europe has also dealt a major blow to our tourist industry; cheaper, better weather, better service.

I know the touirst industry well, I've been working in a related industry and my partner has been involved with the tourist industry here for almost five years. I'm in a tourist area myself and it's become a ghost town. I also know a lot of people who run B&Bs and other tourist-related industries, they're not getting the numbers. All the "holiday homes" that were built out here are either derilict or rented out to locals - and yet they keep building the bloody things - go fig! See that's the thing with Ireland - we keep building and building and building and building - the great Babylonian tower that is the Irish Economy, and nobody wants to admit what we all know to be true. You can't keep building forever, sometime, maybe tomorrow, maybe in five years, it's all going to come collapsing down on top of us.

At any rate, if there's anyone out there reading this who has their heart set on setting up a hostel in Ireland I would suggest someplace along the coast, the Ring of Kerry, West Clare - such as Doolin - or Galway, the Arann Islands, Achill Island in Mayo or Donegal - but you'll have competition to be sure, to be sure. Coastal Ireland is popular for all sorts of tourists, from the big tourbus people, to surfers. Get a lot of Aussie surfers around the cost of Clare actually. [always amused me that your average Aussie wouldn't swim @ home until mid summer (november), yet will gladly plunge into the icy depths of the Atlantic during mid-winter (also november)]

A much safer bet would be concentrating not on tourists, but on migrant workers from Poland, Latvia, Lithuania or Brazil, by offering cheap lodgings for them.

Wow, way to completely veer from one topic to another there huh?

Hostel Witness, you started off really well, then you went pear shaped:p

[redtree]

what are normal licenses and permits required to start a hostel?

[santa klaus]

it's a sad day when the cost of a round of drinks is more than a plane ticket.

So true. I paid € 6.20 for a Coke in a Dublin pub.

[Plakian]

what are normal licenses and permits required to start a hostel?

Each country has their own set of regulations, there is no norm.

For example, here in Greece, you cannot start a hostel unless it is run on a non-commercial basis. Why do you think there are so few hostels in Greece!

[Hostels]

For example, here in Greece, you cannot start a hostel unless it is run on a non-commercial basis.

I've always wondered about the lack of hostels in Greece. It seems like there is a high demand for them there.

I was in the NE Aegean Islands around 2001 and had to turn around at Samos because I couldn't find any cheap accommodation.

[Ria]

I'd be interested to know more about what 'non-commercial' means in Greece?

But as a long time fan of greece....pensions abound on all the islands...and cheap accomodation can be found if you talk with the hordes of people trying to rent you a room when the ferry pulls in.